A/N: After some of the time had passed, I think a little bit of update to this page is perhaps needed.

(Hence the change of the title there).

Now, as I've said before, I'm not one to shit on people's opinions. It's their own perspective on what they think. Certain said opinions can be questioned from time to time whenever you begin to notice something.

I'm not saying their opinions are dumb. I just think that some of the reasons (Mainly on how they transform or about kale's form) people hate these two, the lies people spread because they hate these two, or any of things that don't work. And yes, I'm basically going in an unwinnable fight. But after doing much further looking around, I've seen how most of the stuff people say about the two female saiyans still seems asinine to me. And if i'm going to any more honest, I think this is that rare occasion where the character is getting hate for some of the dumbest reasons.

(And I still think this).

To start it's of course with the whole thing on how they gained their transformations so easily.

I know that their hates are based on their opinions. But this is that rare occasion where the character is getting hate for some of the dumbest reasons.

To start it's of course with the whole thing on how they gained their transformations so easily.

Now Originally, I did a comparison of how the two got the transformation with how kid trunks and goten got them easily as well as how kid goku learned the kamehameha from just observing. But, I'll do something different and go by about them and their alternative saiyan species.

What I think people seem to miss is that fact that the history and current biology of the Universe 6 Saiyans are much different from what the Universe 7 saiyans had.

Granted, it should have been put into more depth for people to see. But, the fact that they say that Saiyans of that universe evolved past the usage of tails and that they fight evil every single day should have come as a clue for people on how different these saiyans were from their U7 counterparts.

For the history, the U6 saiyans didn't go into conflict with each other and didn't result in them having to leave their home. They continued to live on Sadala and would be hired to fight villains every day. And during all that time, they've never been oppressed by an evil ruler, meaning the race itself got stronger over a long period of time throughout their battles with villains without being kept in place by someone.

(A video from Revolushane to give further details).

https://youtu.be/17ElUbCvxpA

Now granted, I DO think that Caulifla got SSJ2 too fast and personally think she should have gotten it around the time of the tournament much like cabba. But, I digress.

And for the S-Cells: I'm not gonna go over that whole thing again. Hardly much is even changed from how goku, vegeta and other saiyans got super saiyan and it hardly could be considered a retcon. I'm just going to take the stuff from one of my other previous edited pages and show you.

White box: It's not like anyone can become a Super Saiyan through training and anger. In order to become a Super Saiyan, one's body must contain something called "S-Cells". Once these S-Cells reach a certain amount, a trigger such as anger will explosively increase the S-Cells and cause a change in the body: that's Super Saiyan. Most Saiyans have some S-Cells, although not a great quantity. the reason why Goku and Vegeta's children can become Super Saiyan relatively easily is probably because to a certain extent they inherited a lot of S-Cells, and also because Earth's environment is gentler and easier to live in than Planet Vegeta.

Tori-bot: "Lately everyone becomes Super Saiyan so easily, but it is no simple matter."

Arrow: And how does one increase S-Cells to become Super Saiyan?

Black box: Having a gentle spirit is the best way to greatly increase one's S-Cells, but most Saiyans have trouble with this, which I think is why no Super Saiyans appeared for such a long time and they became the stuff of legend. However, one can't reach the quantity necessary for becoming a Super Saiyan simply by having a gentle spirit, so a certain amount of battle power is indeed necessary. Looked at in this light, it's easy to see why becoming a Super Saiyan came easy for Goku.

Goten picture: "He was able to easily become Super Saiyan thanks to inheriting lots of S-Cells!"

Goku picture: "A gentle heart + high battle power resulted in Super Saiyan!!"

There's a critical key in this article - A gentle nature is the BEST way to increase one's S-Cells but will not get you to the quantity needed to become a Super Saiyan. The remainder has to be gained through inheritance or a high battle power (and honestly, these two probably amount to the same thing). We know the hybrids had more potential their fathers, and I believe the "Inheritance" S-Cells aren't so much because Goku and Vegeta had a high number of S-Cells, but because Gohan, Goten, and Trunks had human mothers (which is why the U6 Saiyans didn't achieve Super Saiyan from a young age).

So to review, not only does a prerequisite seem to be a Gentle nature from the photo of Goku, and the hybrids, but either a high battle power or inheritance as well. Both Goku and Vegeta's children were stronger than them at the same age, so it may be that this "inheritance" is the same thing as a high battle power.

I think this misunderstanding is why a lot of older fans are upset (and the same ones who are upset about the U6 Saiyans attaining the transformation so easily) - they feel like this cheapens Goku achieving Super Saiyan because a prerequisite is a high number of S-Cells. I'm here to say that the stated "inheritance" is likely from being a half breed, and Goku only had enough S-Cells to become a Super Saiyan through hard work and his gentle nature.

Caulifla is the only U6 Saiyan who transformed using the "back-tingling" method, and I wouldn't be surprised if we found out she was a hybrid later on. Either way, she inherited a high number of S-Cells, so at least now we have an explanation of why it came so easily to her (and plus she's known as a prodigy!). But Cabba and Kale both needed a trigger in order to transform.

Let's move on to when they bring up their personalities.

For Caulifla, She has a very punkish attitude and is also recognized as a tomboy, to which she shows a strong contrast to the rest of her race, acting more akin to the Universe 7 Saiyans. She's also rather self-confident (Which some confuse for arrogance) within her battles against foes. Now, she does do it here and there, but, she's mostly showing confidence in herself given the potential she has.

Despite that, she cared about others. Evidence for this is through her protegee, Kale, who she treated like a younger sister as well as being grateful to cabba for teaching her how to become super saiyan.

Then there's when she's gotten stronger and fighting goku to which she wanted him to teacher her to get stronger. That's sort of understandable in a series like this. Characters want to get stronger and to gain new forms to show off how much they've improved. She started off lazy and uninterested to even enter a tournament to save her own universe. But, it was seeing super saiyan as well as the strong fighters in the tournament that inspired her to get stronger.

Next is Kale.

Her personality is different from other saiyans. She was a very meek and timid individual who showed great insecurity and lack of self-confidence. She openly believed herself to be nothing special and was also shown rather shy at meeting new people. This was shown when she and caulifla first met Goku. This lack of self-confidence had caused Kale to be constantly ridiculed by her fellow Saiyans. Caulifla was the one person who saw that Kale had potential to be something great and as said before, she cared for kale very much and was basically the only friend she had. Throughout the tournament, she soon eventually started to grow more self-confident and even control her berserk/legendary state through Caulifla's help.

Sure as hell know it's anything better than the typical type of other characters who were just there in the background for only a few seconds with one personality.

Next there's when they fought goku.

When Kale fought goku: people yelled up a storm on that day.

They all complained over her reason, what she did and how she did it.

Which beings up people like this Jurassic Slapass:

(Yes, I still think he's acting like one. Especially since he was liking the new broly WAY before the film was even out yet. Pretty much telling me he did it since he's treating kale like the old broly).

Who, in the description of this video here:

https://youtu.be/X_09M9PHpdM

Basically bitched about kale getting made over caulifla ignoring her. Maybe if they payed attention to the relationship and the tension of the scene, He would know that caulifla was showing a big interest in goku on how strong he was and kale was feeling left out and worried that caulifla would forget about her. When she tried to join, goku basically scolded at her. She tried to talk to caulifla about it and even ask her if she wasn't a bother, only for caulifla to reply by not answering and continue the fight with goku. It was bringing back what kale felt like her whole life. Like someone who was nobody and alone. That's why she lost her temper. Not because she was a yandere! Yandere's tend to have a far didn't thing going on.

Then we now go to when she fought goku. To put it plain and simple, There's literally a shit tone of evidence to prove that goku was holding back in that fight against her. Given that he does it in almost every fight he's in ever. And he didn't want to do anything to kill her. 

A. Since he doesn't want to kill her. B. Even if he wanted to, he would have risked his universe getting disqualified and erased. And C. That clearly wasn't a full powered Kamehameha.

The other argument could also be placed that Goku was trying to scout Kale's power considering that the power he was dealing with (at the time of super since Broly didn't show up yet), was something different.

Next, while yes, kale's transformation is similar to broly's. It's clearly being reintroduced as a transformation with a different level of power, the canon broly definitely backs this up. Especially now since broly transformed similar to kale as well as two possessing.

The people also complained about how much she says son goku. Want to know how many times that was?

14 times. At least in the japanese dub. She's called him goku the destroyer of lives, the spineless and all other stuff like that.

https://youtu.be/0sitOB7ocws

Want to know how many times Broly has said Kakarot?

Around nearly 20 times and saying Goku once.

7 in the first film and about 13 times in the second one (he makes a slight gasp of trying to say it when he was bleeding out in the beginning of the second one).

https://youtu.be/XWzUB5xUWdY

The reason why kale says goku's name is cause that's the only name of his she knows. And while she does say it more times than broly does in separate films, it makes more sense for her as I've gone over that she felt that she was going to be ignored and forgotten by her long time best friend, which would have lead to kale going back to how her life was before meeting caulifla.

Broly kept saying kakarot and got angry from seeing him despite that the film never made it clear that he even looked over and saw the face of the one crying next to him (yeah, I'm still doing that).

And I already have a page which shoots that argument in the foot considering they have many differences from each other.

Z Broly:

*His backstory is revealed through a few flashbacks where we see how he became the way he was.

*Somehow survived a stab to the chest without succumbing to blood loss despite only being an infant.

*Held a grudge against goku for 3 years because he cried next to him despite broly never technically saw his face.

*Was being controlled by his father to be used a tool for revenge on Vegeta for the first time before breaking free after seeing Goku.

*Took on 4 super saiyans and piccolo who were around the level of their cell saga versions at best.

*His personality in base form was docile and harmless, only due to his father's control over him. It wasn't until seeing goku that he started to get mad. In his legendary State, He had a thirst for combat and desire for death and destruction of things as well as being sadistic as he laughs or finds enjoyment at the pain others are in.

*Died after he got a hole punched in by goku and exploded (Movie 8 only).

*Somehow survived from that and ended up on earth, frozen (Movie 10).

*Lost any and all sanity and would mostly say kakarot throughout the whole film (Movie 10).

*Fought Gohan, Goten, Trunks, Videl and Krillin (for a mere moment) before finally being put down by a family Kamehameha into the sun. (Movie 10)

*NEVER had full control on his legendary form. He had some bits of intelligence, but, that was soon gone.

Kale:

*Not much is known on her backstory with the exception of a hint given from her in the Manga.

*In Her base form: She was a very meek and timid, Showing great insecurity, lack of self-confidence and shy at meeting others. Which made her socially awkward and constantly ridiculed by others saiyans for it. In the Manga, she was a bit less timid, though, remained meek and subservient and was also shown to be assertive enough to take action.

*Got mad at Goku because Caulifla was taking more interest in him during their fight and Kale thought Caulifla was going to forget about her. Making her say goku's name a few times as wanted to kill him for thinking he was going to take her best friend away. In the manga, she transformed from seeing Caulifla and Cabba being beaten by Golden Frieza.

*In the Anime, She took on a suppressed super saiyan blue goku. In the Manga, beat down an off guard golden frieza and would go on to eventually eliminate 4 universe teams before then attacking her own teammates.

*While her personality in her legendary state was similar to Broly's, her rage soon started to grow and she started to become more savage and merciless in her assaults. However, that soon changed.

*In The Anime, She gained some control in her legendary form and with caulifla, they both fought and eliminated some of the pride troopers. In the Manga, she didn't gain control and was started to lose to the pride troopers on her own.

*Kale not only gained full control over her legendary form, but became more self-confident and earned the full respect of Caulifla.

*In The Anime, she and caulifla took on goku for a while before fusing with her and continued to fight him as Kefla until he reawakened ultra instinct and eventually eliminated her and making the two defuse. In the Manga, as Kefla, she took on Gohan and they all eventually ended up eliminating each other.

*Ended up erased along with everyone else in her universe. But, got brought back later from 17's wish on the super dragon balls.

(And for a bonus).

*in The Super Dragon Ball Heroes Anime, She noticeably showed more self-confidence in herself, not letting her pressuring assault of her foes deter her, even firmly voice her defiance.

They have far more differences between them than they do similarities. She's supposed to be her Universe's version of Broly (The one within Super). Just like how Cabba and Caulifa are their Universe's version of Vegeta and Goku respectively. Similar, but not a complete copy. Her legendary form in the anime just looks like broly's and she's made references to him (in only TWO episodes of her appearances) and while the two had a hatred for goku, kale's at least made more sense and even then, it didn't last long.

Moving on to when Kale and Caulifla both took on goku. Goku, while was healed by frieza after, had a enormous fight with jiren and was damaged bad. Plus, even after frieza healed him, he was still struggling with a few of the other fighters. Kale especially learned to master her legendary super saiyan form and making herself stronger than she was before, Tien even backs this up himself.

https://youtu.be/eMgSjcSQYz8

But they were still struggling a bit with goku in his super saiyan god state, albeit, weakened.

But, it's when the two fused to where people really got to the complaining a lot.

Potara has been proven to be a very powerful version of fusion. Given that Vegito in Buu saga was stated to be far stronger than SSJ3 Goku. So with someone like kale and caulifla, who were above buu saga level, it made sense.

(This for more detail on that).

https://youtu.be/jhO834Fl344

(Trust me, I'm not a fan of laughingstock media myself, but, he makes some good points here and there).

They were a lot stronger and faster as they were before hand given their increase in power. However, them fusing and becoming Kefla, who's power rivaled Goku's Spirit Bomb against Jiren, increased that by even further within one body.

(The Video from Revolushane before for more on that).

It wasn't until goku reawkened ultra instinct and was able to dodge her was she able to be bested. After that, people only complained about the saiyans again when their universe was brought back.

Which brings us to stuff outside the reasons why people hate these two and what people do because they hate them.

First off, there's making the argument to say they're bad characters without actually giving any convincing evidence to people who may think otherwise.

This is where idiots like Seth and his friends come in to be moronic.

https://youtu.be/K2CPRB5J_9o

They say some of the more button of the barrel bullshit and say that the people who actually like the two is because they're cute. Even thought that there are multiple people who say otherwise on this and like them for their relationship, character and personality. Even if it was because they're cute? So what?

Then the rest of the video is just them talking out of their ass as always.

They even got Brunnhilde (Valkyrie)'s story and motives wrong. Proving that they hardly know shit about anything.

Then there's where they do some piss poor comparisons to try and make themselves look smart but makes it sound more like they pulled shit out of their asses.

This is where Vegito1098 and ScarlettDargon1

Here's vegito1098.

First of all, Z Broly was fighting a regular super saiyan goku, whom in a sense, would have to be around the same power as goku in the cell saga considering there wasn't that much of feats shown off within the film to show that they're stronger than that.

(And no, Broly did not destroy the entire south galaxy as the dub tried to make it sound like).

So yeah, he was fucking up THAT goku. Kale was knocking around a suppressed blue goku, who would slap the z broly in a fight. Hell, current base goku alone would be enough to do that. Plus, Legendary Super Saiyan/Full Power Super Saiyan/Super Saiyan Berserk, as of the dragon ball super broly film, is a reintroduction of the form into the series as something more powerful than when it was first shown.

Then we reach the liars and deceivers. TheSuperItachi.

To put it short so I don't keep going on about what I've said about this dipshit before, He made a video where he took something that was said in an interview about kale being an idea from Toei animation.

https://youtu.be/-JppYxnYNO0

What he failed to bring up was that Kale was APPROVED by toriyama, who added caulifla in with her.

If we called something non canon because it wasn't part of toriyama's original idea, then by that logic, we need to call out the entire franchise as a whole. Since toiryama had no original plans to continue the series after the first search for the dragon balls. So yeah, That's not gonna work.

And it just gets worse when he decided to post this garbage.

https://youtu.be/-_W4DL49TWI

He brings up shit about their age from a site he obviously made up and can't back up and tries to say that they're chicks with dicks, even though he never brings this up again at all and just leaves a text asking.

It's also been proven obvious that he likes the the two considering he has porn of them, has art of them on his favorites in deviantart (and pinterest), and has actually came out and said it after he tried to go after geekdom.

https://youtu.be/GH4M_FAkKqk

(The only time he's had the balls to admit he's wrong and when he's been called out. Though, trust me, that's about it from him. Dipshit is still a piece of shit for riding off the vic situation, which he only cares about to get more views).

And for a new add on to this: there's the point now in Super Dragon Ball Heroes where the two get possessed by Oren and Kamin.

People's reactions to that stems down to them basically saying that

All I have to say is that this is just them with white hair and red lines and that I think these people are just being straight up hypocritical now. Considering that this is basically just like Baby Vegeta in his first form and I haven't seen anywhere where someone batted an eye about it.

So after adding some new stuff in as well as make a better point in some stuff, time to give my words on everything.

Do I still think the hate is pretty dumb? Yes. I honestly still think it is. Given that most of if sort of stems down to that they transformed too fast, people tend to lie about them, hate them for the sake of just hating them or jumping on a hating band wagon.

After all that, that's everything I need to give on this. If there's any more new info or stuff to add in I find, I'll add them in whenever I see them.